Foul Language Continued: What does the Bible Say?
21 02 2007Ephesians 4:29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.
So, does that apply to just “expletives” and the like, or does it apply to more than that? Does it apply to, as Jason put it here, “more polite ways of expressing the same thing?”
Ephesians 4:29 goes very well with Guideline #2 in my rather long comment alluded to in your previous post.
The issue in Eph. 4:29 isn’t just the vocabulary, but also the content of what you are trying to say. I can be just as insulting and rude and morally bad using completely benign language, just as someone can say something rather innocuous and incorrupt using crude language.
Euphemisms serve to allow us to refer to sensitive/crude acts in benign contexts without offending people. That is a justifiable purpose in my mind, and doesn’t run afoul of the exhortations in Ephesians and elsewhere in scripture.
I’ve had an ongoing argument with my teenage daughter, that saying the word that starts with “s” and ends with “hit” is neither swearing, nor against anything in the Bible.
Swearing, is defined as making a solemn oath before a Court or God, and saying any foul word at random does not fit with either of those definitions in my book.
Neither does it go against anything that I recall reading in the bible (which is most of it). The Bible clearly says one should not take the Lord’s name in vane. It does not, however, pronounce any modern English “swear” word as unacceptable, since no modern English swear word was in use at the time of the Bible’s writing (nor was the bible written in English), so how could they be?
Your particular selection of quote says: “Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers. ”
That seems pretty wide open to interpretation on it’s own, as it’s literal meaning implies that one may only speak if teaching, or ministering to some other listener.
That seems pretty restrictionist in practice, as I am neither a teacher, nor a minister, and yet, I still feel the need to speak on occasion. How does asking for help when you fall, or telling your kids to do the dishes fit into edifying, or ministering in your book?
You are also not including the preceding comments in the book, which might truly edify the readers, as this may have been a directive aimed at only one person, or one group of persons (perhaps ministers), regarding one particular time, like Sunday services, etc.
Surely, you don’t really believe it is against the will of God that one might ask for help, or tell their kids to do their chores, even if it does not “edify their brains, or minister grace unto their ears.”
I certainly don’t, and in my book, “A rose is a rose, is a rose” applies to most crude language one hears. You may not like the word I use for Pooh, but I can name about 10 other words for Pooh, that you would not like any better. Since in fact, it is not the word for it, but the actual Pooh that is objectionable, I suspect that any word widely used to describe Pooh will eventually become objectionable, too, no matter how many times they change the word. Given the current - lengthy roster of euphemisms for Pooh, and the ONE single word used for Roses, I suspect you can see my point.
This happens with every objectionable thought or object. No one wants to think about it, or objects to being designated as such, and therefore the word for it keeps changing, as the old words become designated as unacceptable. It is not the word’s that are objectionable, it is the trait or item itself, and if you don’t believe me, go through a few items or traits that are objectionable. The more objectionable the trait, the more euphemisms there will be for it.
Thin is thin, but Fat has a multitude of names. Good is good, and Bad has a bunch of names. Same with White/Black, Smart/Stupid, Rich/Poor, Honorable/Criminal, Immigrant/Illegal alien, etc.
You can clearly see that there is no need for euphemisms when you say something considered good, but for every objectionable thought, there are a multitude of words to hide behind, and as each comes into general usage, it becomes kind of a swear word, where you are considered a bad person if you even say it. Even hinting that you know someone is black, is enough to get you fired at this point. Ask Imus. He wasn’t fired for calling those girls “ho’s”, he was fired for calling them “Nappy headed Ho’s”, indicating that they were Black. Had they been white, or undesignated, he would not have been fired, and he was not fired, all the times he’d said it previously in reference to women who were not nappy headed.
I agree we all should try to speak kindly, and use inoffensive language just as a matter of good manners, but please, do not tell me it is forbidden in the Bible. The bible was not written in English, and no modern English words are prohibited. Your quote is out of context, and if followed to it’s logical conclusion, there are going to be a lot of chores left undone across the world from here on, and only God will be left to answer the unspoken requests for help of the elderly or injured in need of it.
(2 Timothy 2:16) KJV “But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.”
(Colossians 3:
KJV “But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.”
(1 Corinthians 15:33) KJV “Be not deceived: evil communications corrupt good manners.”
(Ephesians 4:29) KJV “Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.”
(Ephesians 5:4) KJV “Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks.”
We should avoid filthy talk.
(Matthew 5:16) KJV “Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.”
We are representing our Lord… and swearing and saying foul words is a misrepresentation.
“In all things showing thyself a pattern of good works: in doctrine showing uncorruptness, gravity, sincerity, Sound speech, that cannot be condemned; that he that is of the contrary part may be ashamed, having no evil thing to say of you.” (Titus 2:7-
Swearing makes the unsaved stand up and take notice to our behaviour. Even they know that swearing is a foul and unloving thing. It dennotes anger, frustration, hate, and other negative emotions. Christains are then misrepresenting their Lord and Savior.
(Colossians 4:6) KJV “Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that ye may know how ye ought to answer every man.”
(James 1:26) KJV “If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man’s religion is vain.”
(Matthew 15:11) Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.
(1 Corinthians 8: 8-13) KJV “Wherefore, if meat make my brother to offend, I will eat no flesh while the world standeth, lest I make my brother to offend.”
(1 Corinthians 10: 31) Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God
You will know them by their fruits.
(Matthew 7:16) KJV “Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?”
(Matthew 7:17) KJV “Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.”
(Matthew 7:1
KJV “A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.”
We are known by our fruits. As Christains we should not be known by fruits of foul speech.
I totally agree wtih Josuha Adams and I love how you backed what you were saying with the word of God. That is so important. I am a baby in Christ, but I knew when I was in the world that foul language was wrong. Thank you Josuha for your view and the sciptures, they will help me with my studies.
K, I believe you are taking it out of context. You need to make sure that what you are saying lines up with the word of God. Also, back it up with scripture. Just because you read the bible does not mean you understand. I try praying before I read and ask God for unerstanding. I pray that God blesses you and you get understanding.
I pray that my comments do not offend anyone and may God bless you all.
Lets apply the word K was talking about to each of the Bible Verses Joshua Adams mentioned
KJV “But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.”
(2 Timothy 2:16) KJV “But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.”
Is s*** more profane then pooh? Who gets to decide? I agree we should not say profane words, but what words are profane?
(Colossians 3:
No filthy words, ok. Is s*** more filthy then pooh? Who decides?
(1 Corinthians 15:33) KJV “Be not deceived: evil communications corrupt good manners.”
Is s*** evil? I don’t think so, but even if it was, is it more evil then poopy?
(Ephesians 4:29) KJV “Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.”
S*** more corrupt then pooh? How do you know? Where is the formula?
(Ephesians 5:4) KJV “Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks.”
S*** more foolish? I think dokkie is pretty foolish.
(Matthew 5:16) KJV “Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.”
? No language talk here.
“In all things showing thyself a pattern of good works: in doctrine showing uncorruptness, gravity, sincerity, Sound speech, that cannot be condemned; that he that is of the contrary part may be ashamed, having no evil thing to say of you.” (Titus 2:7-
S*** less sound then pooh? I don’t think so. If saying s*** makes you ashamed, then don’t say it. Either way the Bible had nothing to say on this subject.
(Colossians 4:6) KJV “Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that ye may know how ye ought to answer every man.”
Is pooh graceful?
(James 1:26) KJV “If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man’s religion is vain.”
Pooh more bridled? No!
(Matthew 15:11) Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.
I think I am making my point. This clearly refers to how you speak about other or to people. “Politely” hurting someone’s feelings is much work then saying s*** when you stub your toe.
(1 Corinthians 8: 8-13) KJV “Wherefore, if meat make my brother to offend, I will eat no flesh while the world standeth, lest I make my brother to offend.”
This is probably your best argument. If my saying s*** offends you, I agree that I should not. For this reason alone I make a serious effort not to say many words. I would ask you to consider that leading people to believe the Bible makes ANY comment on the word s*** is offensive to many. It clearly does not mention this word. Perhaps to avoid offending people like K and myself you should refrain from that in the future.
(1 Corinthians 10: 31) Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God
s*** give God less glory then pooh does it? I don’t think so
(Matthew 7:16) KJV “Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?”
Is s*** a grape or thorn? How can one tell?
(Matthew 7:17) KJV “Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.”
Is pooh a better fruit then s***? Answer, NO!
K’s point is well made. The Bible simply does not address the word s***. Nor does it mention any other word that some people today consider curse words.
Adam - All great verses. They all address our speech in some way. I agree with them all. They just don’t mention s*** vs pooh. They don’t give us guidance on which words are foul and which are not.
Gia, you mention backing up comments with scripture, but read them again. Which one mentions the word s***? Which one gives us direction between choosing s*** or some childish alternative? The answer is that none of them do. I would ask that you also reconsider praying that people who disagree with you come to see things your way. Nothing is more frustrating that having a debate about religion only to have one person say something about praying for them to so they understand. Plenty of people who have given their hearts to Christ disagree about things.
I too hope my comments have not offended.
God Bless
Thank you all for posting those verses, I was searching online to find a list of verses on the topic, and this has helped me a lot.
In response to the topic at hand, however, I think that some of you are really on the wrong track here. The question should not be “what’s wrong with it?” or “how close can I get to darkness without actually sinning?” but rather “what’s right with it?” Don’t settle for a normative life - pursue righteousness to the extreme! Try to figure out the best way of glorifying God with your speech.
For me, I praise God and thank God through difficulties, while my co-workers swear and complain. I try to be a light to them.
And, speaking of my co-workers, when I’m around enough filthy jesting and crude language, I just get so sick of it I never ever want to hear any of it again, much less let any of it come out my own mouth, and that’s a good thing.
Let yourself get sick of the filthiness of this world, and pursue something higher, something purer!
May God Bless You All Richly!
Rebekah, you sound like what my mom always said: “What’s right with it?” Very true…
I have really enjoyed reading through everybody’s comments on the subject, it is something I have been thinking about lately. In the past year I have started using “curse” words more commonly. I’m not here to argue what the bible says is right and wrong (though I do believe that it is important), but to explain what I have noticed in my relationships.
The first thing I have realized is that people are a lot less likely to show me respect when I use profane language. I have noticed that after using a few curse words around somebody, they take what I say a lot less seriously. The second thing I have been able to conclude is that many people, not just followers of Christ, feel that I am not a good Christian if I curse, and that I am a hypocrite.
Just from observing these behaviors I have come to the conclusion that using profane language is counter productive in my mission to show people Jesus’ love. Whether cursing is a sin or not, It certainly doesn’t help in drawing people toward God but rather pushing them away. Jesus asks us to shine his light to the world and to glorify Him. I’m going to be trying my best to not curse, not because I believe it is right or wrong, but because the thought of making somebody discredit what I believe in because of my language and not having the chance to show them the love of Jesus is not something I ever want to do.
Dylan
Dylan, I hadn’t thought about the respect factor. Thanks for commenting about those effects.
I think some people might have more effective use of colorful language depending upon the setting and parameters of the discourse. “Everything is permissible but not everything is beneficial. Everything is permissible, but not everything is constructive” (I Corinthians 10:23). After examining the structure within which one operates and estimating appropriate verbiage (for example, working with troubled youth who would rather receive a Christian message without the usual subjective social norms) anyone with a message of strength and hope may rely on whatever vernacular conducts a contructive and beneficial message. Use whatever words you want, just make sure there’s good reason for it.
Thank you for this talk about foul talk, as I teach at a local jail every Monday night and I am going to use some of what you talked about in my lesson tonight. Backing everything up with the word of God is awesome.
May God bless you for all that you are doing,
Julie
Thanks, Julie.
[...] popular post ever: Very short. Foul Language Continued. What Does the Bible Say? Second by about four hundred hits is this, my examination of whether or not man is inherently good. [...]
Both K and Joshua are correct. Yes, we are not to use crude language and Rebekah had a good point when she said to ask “What is right with it?”
What everyone seems to forget pretty quickly is that Paul used a cuss word worse than our word **** in Phillipians 3:8. He says he considers his former life to be utter ****. He didn’t use such polite language though and he did it on purpose. He very clearly WANTED to turn heads. His point was to get through to people.
From the Blog Admin: Daniel, I appreciate your comment. Please note in future comments on this blog that the use of any euphemisms, swearing, or cuss words of any sort is strictly prohibited. Thank you for your consideration.
I have to agree with K and Craig on this one. I have never felt ashamed of saying any 4 letter words, It was always normal vocabulary in my household and family get togethers. And I have always known my family to be God loving Christians and nothing less. Before I bring my point may I say this. Who are you to choose which words are okay and which are not. Are you saying that someone who uses the word S*** or F*** is any less of a Christian?
Romans 14:2-4 One man’s faith allows him to eat everything, but another man, whose faith is weak, eats only vegetables. 3The man who eats everything must not look down on him who does not, and the man who does not eat everything must not condemn the man who does, for God has accepted him. 4Who are you to judge someone else’s servant? To his own master he stands or falls. And he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand.
Romans 14:16 Do not allow what you consider good to be spoken of as evil.
As for using words like S*** or F***. Is calling someone a Fool better then calling them a B****? No.
Jesus condemned calling one a fool out of unjustified anger (Matt. 5:22). If one calls another a fool out of sinful hate, then calling someone such a name (or any similar term) is wrong.
So if you are speaking out of anger toward someone, then yes..that is wrong according to the bible. But….you could be saying, you are a idiot…or you are a B****. either way, its still wrong.
But to stub your toe and scream “S***”, or in general conversation use F***, instead of “Darn”…it isnt wrong.
Daniel G,
“Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ” Phillipians 3:8
That’s not a cuss word. It simply means that Paul considered that, unless something was gained for the service of Christ, he considered it useless.
What Paul clearly wanted was to teach people, especially the church at Philipi,
was that without Christ, we are nothing. And here he pretty much states that
before he had Christ, he was useless.
Samantha,
we are not trying to tell people what they can or cannot say.
To say that some word are not right in one instance, but wrong in another is incorrect. If we consider it wrong sometimes, and not others, would that not be considered being double minded?
“A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.” James 1:8
It is impossible for something to both be right and wrong at the same time.
“Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.” Ephesians 4:29.
Now, not defining what is meant by “corrupt communication”, let me ask this one question: If we cuss, are we minustering grace to those around us?
Ineresting and insightful comments but one of the things I ddn’t see mentioned is that the dictionary does in fact define what words are considered obscene, vulgar etc. in our society. These definitions represent what is commonly accepted by the FCC in governing what language is accepable under various broadcast situations as well and in which circumstances may stations be fined ($375,000 per incident) for permitting or allowing the transmission of objectionable language (i.e. no bleep). So to state that no one can say what is objectionable language is false. So if Christians and others want to avoid offending people (remember love your neighbors) who find such language objectionable they will avoid the use of such language in addition to all the other (very clear in my view) statements in the bible regarding the avoidance of filthy speech as referenced in previous comments.
All effective language use depends on a common understanding of the meaning of words (hence the roleof a dictionary) and so it is a vacuous argument to say it’s arbitrary what words are insulting, obscene and so forth. Why do you think they put ratings on movies that indicate that some language in the movie is profane? Granted not everyone feels such words are profane but not everyone agrees with many of the “rules” that govern a civil society. Those who disagree have given us what we have today…..kids and adults that can’t express themselves without the use of such language, (just ask teachers), sports where many paarents won’t take their kids because of foul language, mindless humor predicated only on the use of obscenities (recent cruise I took was a good example) and so forth.
It’s a sad commentary (but necessary) that the discussion is around this issue and not on how to improve our discourse and our minds. Remember what Jesus said …that your words reflect what is in your heart and so by your words you will be known and by your words you will be judged!!
Yours in Christ, AB